Re: Genocide

liquitech1 wrote:

it's very simple.

Unlike the middle east conflict.

Re: Genocide

Correct, Yant. What could be more complicated than 4 kids playing football on a beach and receiving missiles from F-16s. Such a complicated part of the war that one....aren't you the one who gets his daily fix of explosions from Spiderman movies?

Last edited by liquitech1 (Friday Jul 2014 04:00:55)

Re: Genocide

You could make the same argument for the other side couldn't you mate.  Innocent people/kids etc being killed necessarily on both sides.

Re: Genocide

Yant wrote:

You could make the same argument for the other side couldn't you mate.  Innocent people/kids etc being killed necessarily on both sides.

Put simply, no you couldn't say the same....2 people have died from home made rockets fired from Gaza into Israel, over 800 have now died from high tech weaponry fired from Apache helicopters, F-16s, Navy gunboats and drone strikes by the IDF.

Gaza is an open air prison under constant bombardment, it only really makes waves when large numbers get killed but there are kids shot dead close to checkpoints and the cage wall almost daily.  Not trying to have an argument mate but balancing the 2 sides as even, especially given the number of innocent children murdered in Gaza, just points to the fact you haven't really got the foggiest idea what's going on out there.

Re: Genocide

They should just let the Palestinian's move over to the UK and away from the Israelis. Problem solved.

Re: Genocide

liquitech1 wrote:
Yant wrote:

You could make the same argument for the other side couldn't you mate.  Innocent people/kids etc being killed necessarily on both sides.

Put simply, no you couldn't say the same....2 people have died from home made rockets fired from Gaza into Israel, over 800 have now died from high tech weaponry fired from Apache helicopters, F-16s, Navy gunboats and drone strikes by the IDF.

Gaza is an open air prison under constant bombardment, it only really makes waves when large numbers get killed but there are kids shot dead close to checkpoints and the cage wall almost daily.  Not trying to have an argument mate but balancing the 2 sides as even, especially given the number of innocent children murdered in Gaza, just points to the fact you haven't really got the foggiest idea what's going on out there.

You're obviously very passionate about it, but your posts suggest that Israel are the only party guilty here and everyone else is innocent and are the victims is just plain wrong. In my personal opinion, quite the opposite. But I'm not going to get into that on this message board that's fo sho!

Re: Genocide

Strong whiff of Anti-Semitism/Spurs in this thread.

Re: Genocide

Israel are occupying lands illegally, have broken several UN laws on settling and continue to pound an innocent civilian population, then yes I put all the blame on them. I don't condone Hamas when they try and kill innocent Israelis but come on, what are we really arguing about here, whose to blame? Israel has a right to defend itself but those who it oppresses don't?

I previously mentioned that the whitewash was the issue I had a problem with and the complicity in war crimes over there by the US & British govts, I'm not using this opp to bash Israel although it's very hard not to.

Re: Genocide

Mr Boring wrote:

Strong whiff of Anti-Semitism/Spurs in this thread.

Funny you should mention that, I've a mate who stands with Israel against the "terrorists", he's a Spurs fan.

Re: Genocide

Why do you hate Jewish people so much?

Re: Genocide

Have you seen the way they dress on hot humid days?

Re: Genocide

Wearing a little hat over the bald spot makes sense to me.

Re: Genocide

Mr Boring wrote:

They should just let the Palestinian's move over to the UK and away from the Israelis. Problem solved.


Would this have any effect on my house price?

Just asking.

Re: Genocide

liquitech1 wrote:

... for me it's the whitewash from Cameron, Obama etc thats sickening.  There's no other conflict on the planet right now that Western media distorts as much.

Jewish money and the influence it brings have been an integral part of the UK & US for far longer than the State of Israel has existed - rightly or wrongly 'the West' always sides with Israel although Netanyahu currently gives the impression he's taking that support for granted...

Re: Genocide

monostereo wrote:
Mr Boring wrote:

They should just let the Palestinian's move over to the UK and away from the Israelis. Problem solved.


Would this have any effect on my house price?

Just asking.

lol. NIMBY!

We're putting them in a new development by White Hart Lane, so nothing for you to worry about.

Re: Genocide

This thread Israel-y interesting.












Have that you sl*gs!

Re: Genocide

smashdad wrote:
liquitech1 wrote:

... for me it's the whitewash from Cameron, Obama etc thats sickening.  There's no other conflict on the planet right now that Western media distorts as much.

Jewish money and the influence it brings have been an integral part of the UK & US for far longer than the State of Israel has existed - rightly or wrongly 'the West' always sides with Israel although Netanyahu currently gives the impression he's taking that support for granted...

All that goes without saying but it feels different this time given the amount of evidence for war crimes and the stonewalling from Cameron et al when questioned on it.

I wish ill health on David Cameron and any other robot who argues for the IDF. Kick racism out of football but let it thrive in Israel.

Re: Genocide

I've never liked or rated Yossi Benayoun.

Re: Genocide

liquitech1 wrote:

DrWho, the concept of genocide isn't based on numbers FYI. What's happening in Gaza is one of the purest forms of genocide there is. How you can claim what's happening in Gaza is different to Syria, Iraq or the Congo is beyond me. That's absolute rubbish if I'm being honest. Systematic killing goes on there every single day, whether the conflict makes news or not and has been for decades. Based on the reasoning behind it, it would seem you have your wires crossed with what constitutes genocide.

Not suggesting it's based on numbers at all. It's based on a systematic extermination of a group of people based on a trait. There's a lot of terrible shit going on in the Middle East but Israel isn't exterminating Palestinians. There have been enough corroborated reports from the UN that suggest Hamas actively stores weapons and militants in schools, hospitals and UN buildings. There have been more disturbing reports that I won't mention because who the fuck knows if they're true.

Of course, none of of us have been in Gaza to see if civilians are being used as human shields, but let's be absolutely clear Hamas is a militant terrorist organization and is recognized as such by the majority of the world. If you want to see genocide give Hamas the military capabilities of the Israeli army. In the first paragraph of their charter they make very clear that Israel and Israelis need to be wiped off the face of the earth. Even the Arab countries, outside of Iran, have no interest in giving arms to Hamas.

Also, to say that Israel is an illegally held territory at this point is incorrect. There is a long and complicated history surrounding the area but making a statement like that reveals rancor that is hard to ignore. It's important to note that before 1948 the area was essentially desert. Israeli's have become a thriving and innovative people and Israel has become a beacon for scientific and technological advancements around the world.

This isn't Israel flexing its muscle to punish Palestinians. That argument falls apart when you realize there's a ceasefire on the table that Israel has accepted and Hamas continues to reject. Hamas rejects it because of the blockades. Blockades that were set up to prevent suicide and car bombings, which stopped as soon as the blockades were implemented.

Given all of that, to label this as genocide is a snap judgment based on talking points and incorrect information.

I don't have a solution outside of spiking the drinking water in the area with LSD or firing Psilocybin spores into the entire Middle East.

It's sad and my heart goes out to every single person who is affected by the actions of people who have no interest in peace or compassion.

Last edited by drwho13 (Friday Jul 2014 06:28:51)

Re: Genocide

I think you have to get used to the fact some people like shooting one another.

Re: Genocide

will never get used to it.

cultivate inner-peace then you can start trying to fix everything around you. personally, i'm still working on that first part.

Re: Genocide

I have met many many people all over the world who wouldn't bat an eye at cutting your throat. Call it desensitised or whatever but in general they can kill without it bothering them. The two warring factors you mention would like nothing more than to kill one of their enemies and enjoy every second of it.

Re: Genocide

Decent post that drwho

kudos

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I am STILL a child of the 80s mix: https://soundcloud.com/themills23/i-am- … of-the-80s

Re: Genocide

What's your kill count Uncle Bazza?

Re: Genocide

drwho13 wrote:

Israel isn't exterminating Palestinians.

Actually they are, the numbers prove it and the motives behind it given in the Knesset back up the claim.

drwho13 wrote:

There have been enough corroborated reports from the UN that suggest Hamas actively stores weapons and militants in schools, hospitals and UN buildings.

Proof of these reports, please? that's a stock answer given by almost everyone who is Pro-Israeli, none of it is ever substantiated, especially in the last 2 weeks. Just yesterday, that was the excuse given by the IDF for the murder of children in a UNRWA safe zone (the school). They're on record stating no "warnings "were given and that there was zero activity in the school, or in the hospitals for that matter, to back up any of those claims. Unless the UNWRA is working directly with Hamas.

drwho13 wrote:

Of course, none of of us have been in Gaza to see if civilians are being used as human shields, but let's be absolutely clear Hamas is a militant terrorist organization and is recognized as such by the majority of the world.

There are plenty of videos on Twitter and Liveleak of civilians being bombed in the streets as they run from their homes, they're not cowering in corners while Hamas fire out the windows. The word "terrorist" is so fucking inflammatory considering the connotation the US has put on the word since 9/11. They're an organisation fighting for their right to exist as humans and fighting against a tyrannical regime. Of course they want them wiped off the face of the earth. If you're a member of Hamas, chances are you've had family members and friends killed by the IDF. I don't buy into that romantic Yank rhetoric at all about the world against terrorists. It's pathetic considering the largest proponent of state terrorism is the US itself.

drwho13 wrote:

This isn't Israel flexing its muscle to punish Palestinians.

For the love of God are you serious? There's diplomats from countries all over the world sitting in Tel Aviv right now watching the IDF at work. It could easily be described as a massive armaments convention. The Israeli ambassador stood up in DC last week and said "they come to Tel Aviv to see how good we get the job done." The IDF uses Flechette shells and phosphorus was used in 2012. You live in dreamland my friend.

drwho13 wrote:

That argument falls apart when you realize there's a ceasefire on the table that Israel has accepted and Hamas continues to reject. Hamas rejects it because of the blockades. Blockades that were set up to prevent suicide and car bombings, which stopped as soon as the blockades were implemented.

More crap, the ceasefire was brokered between Sisi and Netanyahu without consulting Hamas. Hamas didn't get a chance to reject it. It was used as an excuse to escalate the ground offensive.

On the subject of human shields, the only evidence I've seen of it occurring is when the IDF use young Palestinian boys.

http://palestinechronicle.com/uploads/1240951232human_shield_boy_soldiers.jpg